Recently I had a discussion with a friend. He is very logical and data driven while I am more of the emotional and tiagong side.
So we discussed on this topic. And I realise it's very hard to get him to see my point of view and vice versa. Cos he demands facts and data.
Example
If a govt policy negatively affects 20% but positively affects 80%, is it a good policy?
Based on absolute data, it's a good policy. It sucks to be the 20% but that is "feeling" cos based on data and logic, it benefits the majority and that's it.
Cost of living. If someone kpkb to him about increased cost of living for Singaporeans, he will ask is it only you being affected or many Singaporeans?
if it's only you, it's only one person and the G has to think for the rest
If it's many Singaporeans, he will say name them. Cos anyone can say many Singaporeans to prove a point, right or wrong. Give data or prove that many Singaporeans actually face the problem (actual survey and matched with actual salaries).
And many other examples
But I did mention to him that if going purely by logic, it will be a very cold and selfish world and his comment is that it has always been a cold and selfish world.
What do you people think?
Should discussions be made based on logic or emotions? And of cos by extension should decisions be made based on emotions or logic?
Example. A very ill baby with no real hope of survival. Let's say a 1 year old not breathing for 20 minutes Liao.
Logically, call it quits based on data and prognosis
Emotionally, keep trying cos the baby is so young must do the best even if logically you know no more hope.
What will you choose?
I also went with this guy travelling before and he commented I snore loudly. I told him actually he also snored.
Then we came to a logical conclusion
Actually both of us snore but it's the one who falls asleep second who will be the one complaining of the snoring and since I usually knock out in the hotel room early, that's why he always report I snore. But on the odd time when he fell asleep first, I report he snore
Logic at its finest. Everyone snores. The only issue is who falls asleep first
Quote from: Philipkee on Aug 26, 2024, 09:03 PMRecently I had a discussion with a friend. He is very logical and data driven while I am more of the emotional and tiagong side.
So we discussed on this topic. And I realise it's very hard to get him to see my point of view and vice versa. Cos he demands facts and data.
Example
If a govt policy negatively affects 20% but positively affects 80%, is it a good policy?
Based on absolute data, it's a good policy. It sucks to be the 20% but that is "feeling" cos based on data and logic, it benefits the majority and that's it.
Cost of living. If someone kpkb to him about increased cost of living for Singaporeans, he will ask is it only you being affected or many Singaporeans?
if it's only you, it's only one person and the G has to think for the rest
If it's many Singaporeans, he will say name them. Cos anyone can say many Singaporeans to prove a point, right or wrong. Give data or prove that many Singaporeans actually face the problem (actual survey and matched with actual salaries).
And many other examples
But I did mention to him that if going purely by logic, it will be a very cold and selfish world and his comment is that it has always been a cold and selfish world.
What do you people think?
Should discussions be made based on logic or emotions? And of cos by extension should decisions be made based on emotions or logic?
Example. A very ill baby with no real hope of survival. Let's say a 1 year old not breathing for 20 minutes Liao.
Logically, call it quits based on data and prognosis
Emotionally, keep trying cos the baby is so young must do the best even if logically you know no more hope.
What will you choose?
this world is rike this rah..
anyway if have evidence will win roh
:frown:
Quote from: jim889 on Aug 26, 2024, 09:12 PMthis world is rike this rah..
anyway if have evidence will win roh
:frown:
Evidence can be manipulated
Quote from: Philipkee on Aug 26, 2024, 09:17 PMEvidence can be manipulated
normally ask for reports , peer review paper etc
of coz if pay ppl write reports they will write the report that you want.
is a balancing act , what weight to put on these reports and facts
:frown:
i got a friend very similar to ur friend. everything want logics and facts
as in u must have substantiation
say u sell him idea for biz, he wants exact figures and very data driven, hes auditor btw........ pissed me off until no longer friends
his start up also failed anyway
Quote from: Philipkee on Aug 26, 2024, 09:03 PMRecently I had a discussion with a friend. He is very logical and data driven while I am more of the emotional and tiagong side.
So we discussed on this topic. And I realise it's very hard to get him to see my point of view and vice versa. Cos he demands facts and data.
Example
If a govt policy negatively affects 20% but positively affects 80%, is it a good policy?
Based on absolute data, it's a good policy. It sucks to be the 20% but that is "feeling" cos based on data and logic, it benefits the majority and that's it.
Cost of living. If someone kpkb to him about increased cost of living for Singaporeans, he will ask is it only you being affected or many Singaporeans?
if it's only you, it's only one person and the G has to think for the rest
If it's many Singaporeans, he will say name them. Cos anyone can say many Singaporeans to prove a point, right or wrong. Give data or prove that many Singaporeans actually face the problem (actual survey and matched with actual salaries).
And many other examples
But I did mention to him that if going purely by logic, it will be a very cold and selfish world and his comment is that it has always been a cold and selfish world.
What do you people think?
Should discussions be made based on logic or emotions? And of cos by extension should decisions be made based on emotions or logic?
Example. A very ill baby with no real hope of survival. Let's say a 1 year old not breathing for 20 minutes Liao.
Logically, call it quits based on data and prognosis
Emotionally, keep trying cos the baby is so young must do the best even if logically you know no more hope.
What will you choose?
I agree most decisions made in a democracy is based on general good of most of the society
But !!
If almost all society r wealthy and say lopsided median is 75% percentage while mean is 80%
While the poorest 0-74% r like only enuf to eat 3 meals full but cannot hv enuf to plan for en betterment of own lives
Then we can be almost v sure most of decisions r made by elites for most of the elites or wealthier 75% richer
Because 95% of power is in hands of 5%
And humans r born selfish without God or absolute morality it s all abt
"What I deem best for my pov"
Here the my pov refers to majority represented pov
By a few powerful leaders for the majority
Even ruling p also mk life hell for opp p whenever election time is near mah
There is never fair fight in real world de
Where u born
Yr genetics
And the envt u get who u born to alr sets largely a lot of parameters for one's life alr
So while lot of based on facts
N decision must be mk on fact no feelings
Let us be reminded that history written by victors
Losers r only shit n nobody's
Data like accounting or story or dough can be shaped to be presented to look a certain way
Think grc or jelly molds or sand castles
Ya u get it la
Quote from: Philipkee on Aug 26, 2024, 09:03 PMRecently I had a discussion with a friend. He is very logical and data driven while I am more of the emotional and tiagong side.
So we discussed on this topic. And I realise it's very hard to get him to see my point of view and vice versa. Cos he demands facts and data.
Example
If a govt policy negatively affects 20% but positively affects 80%, is it a good policy?
Based on absolute data, it's a good policy. It sucks to be the 20% but that is "feeling" cos based on data and logic, it benefits the majority and that's it.
Cost of living. If someone kpkb to him about increased cost of living for Singaporeans, he will ask is it only you being affected or many Singaporeans?
if it's only you, it's only one person and the G has to think for the rest
If it's many Singaporeans, he will say name them. Cos anyone can say many Singaporeans to prove a point, right or wrong. Give data or prove that many Singaporeans actually face the problem (actual survey and matched with actual salaries).
And many other examples
But I did mention to him that if going purely by logic, it will be a very cold and selfish world and his comment is that it has always been a cold and selfish world.
What do you people think?
Should discussions be made based on logic or emotions? And of cos by extension should decisions be made based on emotions or logic?
Example. A very ill baby with no real hope of survival. Let's say a 1 year old not breathing for 20 minutes Liao.
Logically, call it quits based on data and prognosis
Emotionally, keep trying cos the baby is so young must do the best even if logically you know no more hope.
What will you choose?
U pic v cute 🥰
Quote from: jim889 on Aug 26, 2024, 09:23 PMnormally ask for reports , peer review paper etc
of coz if pay ppl write reports they will write the report that you want.
is a balancing act , what weight to put on these reports and facts
:frown:
Most accurate critique of myself is yr own enemy actually and when one is alone and solo and silent befor God
Quote from: Philipkee on Aug 26, 2024, 09:07 PMI also went with this guy travelling before and he commented I snore loudly. I told him actually he also snored.
Then we came to a logical conclusion
Actually both of us snore but it's the one who falls asleep second who will be the one complaining of the snoring and since I usually knock out in the hotel room early, that's why he always report I snore. But on the odd time when he fell asleep first, I report he snore
Logic at its finest. Everyone snores. The only issue is who falls asleep first
Ppl who don't zz at first 1-3 nights died fr all the surrounding snoring
Quote from: EncourageSome1 on Aug 26, 2024, 09:54 PMI agree most decisions made in a democracy is based on general good of most of the society
But !!
If almost all society r wealthy and say lopsided median is 75% percentage while mean is 80%
While the poorest 0-74% r like only enuf to eat 3 meals full but cannot hv enuf to plan for en betterment of own lives
Then we can be almost v sure most of decisions r made by elites for most of the elites or wealthier 75% richer
Because 95% of power is in hands of 5%
And humans r born selfish without God or absolute morality it s all abt
"What I deem best for my pov"
Here the my pov refers to majority represented pov
By a few powerful leaders for the majority
Even ruling p also mk life hell for opp p whenever election time is near mah
There is never fair fight in real world de
Where u born
Yr genetics
And the envt u get who u born to alr sets largely a lot of parameters for one's life alr
So while lot of based on facts
N decision must be mk on fact no feelings
Let us be reminded that history written by victors
Losers r only shit n nobody's
Data like accounting or story or dough can be shaped to be presented to look a certain way
Think grc or jelly molds or sand castles
Ya u get it la
Democracy is the tyranny of the majority over the minority
Democracy is 2 wolves and a lamb deciding what's for dinner
Quote from: Philipkee on Aug 26, 2024, 09:03 PMRecently I had a discussion with a friend. He is very logical and data driven while I am more of the emotional and tiagong side.
So we discussed on this topic. And I realise it's very hard to get him to see my point of view and vice versa. Cos he demands facts and data.
Example
If a govt policy negatively affects 20% but positively affects 80%, is it a good policy?
Based on absolute data, it's a good policy. It sucks to be the 20% but that is "feeling" cos based on data and logic, it benefits the majority and that's it.
Cost of living. If someone kpkb to him about increased cost of living for Singaporeans, he will ask is it only you being affected or many Singaporeans?
if it's only you, it's only one person and the G has to think for the rest
If it's many Singaporeans, he will say name them. Cos anyone can say many Singaporeans to prove a point, right or wrong. Give data or prove that many Singaporeans actually face the problem (actual survey and matched with actual salaries).
And many other examples
But I did mention to him that if going purely by logic, it will be a very cold and selfish world and his comment is that it has always been a cold and selfish world.
What do you people think?
Should discussions be made based on logic or emotions? And of cos by extension should decisions be made based on emotions or logic?
Example. A very ill baby with no real hope of survival. Let's say a 1 year old not breathing for 20 minutes Liao.
Logically, call it quits based on data and prognosis
Emotionally, keep trying cos the baby is so young must do the best even if logically you know no more hope.
What will you choose?
Humans r biased de la
Now if I sick n can't live on myself
I don't want life support to artificially keep me alive
But if now same case u give me a baby 👶🏻 I took from dustbin
And suddenly u said he dying after 1 month I Tk care him
Then u ask me want try 101 ways to save him or not I sure say must try la he young got chance mah
So yea
When we come we come emotionally unattached n crying
When we go we left a world w 99 emotions but whether we want other to cry or not depends on how we r with them during this life
Quote from: Philipkee on Aug 26, 2024, 09:59 PMDemocracy is the tyranny of the majority over the minority
Democracy is 2 wolves and a lamb deciding what's for dinner
Wah v sad Heng I m bear
Quote from: Philipkee on Aug 26, 2024, 09:03 PMRecently I had a discussion with a friend. He is very logical and data driven while I am more of the emotional and tiagong side.
So we discussed on this topic. And I realise it's very hard to get him to see my point of view and vice versa. Cos he demands facts and data.
Example
If a govt policy negatively affects 20% but positively affects 80%, is it a good policy?
Based on absolute data, it's a good policy. It sucks to be the 20% but that is "feeling" cos based on data and logic, it benefits the majority and that's it.
Cost of living. If someone kpkb to him about increased cost of living for Singaporeans, he will ask is it only you being affected or many Singaporeans?
if it's only you, it's only one person and the G has to think for the rest
If it's many Singaporeans, he will say name them. Cos anyone can say many Singaporeans to prove a point, right or wrong. Give data or prove that many Singaporeans actually face the problem (actual survey and matched with actual salaries).
And many other examples
But I did mention to him that if going purely by logic, it will be a very cold and selfish world and his comment is that it has always been a cold and selfish world.
What do you people think?
Should discussions be made based on logic or emotions? And of cos by extension should decisions be made based on emotions or logic?
Example. A very ill baby with no real hope of survival. Let's say a 1 year old not breathing for 20 minutes Liao.
Logically, call it quits based on data and prognosis
Emotionally, keep trying cos the baby is so young must do the best even if logically you know no more hope.
What will you choose?
In safety ra
We check likelihood n severity
So if sthg v likely (10)
N fatal (10) non fatal , paralysis causing , hurt n pain , skin deep (2)etc
If high on either then must eliminate
So if benefit 80
Harm 20%
Eg dumping of radioactive waste containment water into oceans
To 100% certainty will harm
But if don't dump , earth quake will harm 1000%
They j gov choose the 100% certainty will harm
How fatal : depends on how u defined
If ur face turned glowing after 5-10 yr
Not fatal what
If u died nx yr : year fatal
So neh mind just dump
Very tough question and I have no answer to that
I encountered something similar before. I realised ppl like to bring in personal opinion as facts. I ever discussed with a biker fren about motorcycles in sg. He said gov is against motorcyclists and want to tekan them. However, I doubt there is proof of that and his accusations are just speculation. It's good to share personal opinions though but shouldn't treat them as absolute truth without basis.
Depends on how good is the people handling the data. U do know we hv half data..
If gst goes up, see the prices r up even higher. Feeling is right. Both facts & feel are important.
Only 2 things r real in life for dinkies. Taxes & death.
feelings 1st logic 2nd
From our experience on hwz already know people cannot handle facts and reasoning one lolololol...
Cause they won't be so hardworking to do the hard work.
Even Senior Mod Intrinion can lie about reading a scientific journal in full, but kenna sexposed to read only the "abstract" because it's convenient to cherry pick that to support his POV....
Same what
Got people go parliament ask for facts figures data aka logic
People use emotion aka question
Whats the point of this.
Why surprised ley.
Already see it being done at high level liao
Simple one, don't even need to argue 2 pax. I sometimes alone also struggle with myself on betting method.
Bacaraat table _- focus on just result player win, banker win, tie only.
Beside screen shows previous rounds results.
pbppppbttbtbp
U look at screen. Without habing been there for the previous results so u didn't have chance to see the cards dealt and count yr probability of remaining cards face value.
Logic means bet on p but that's cos based on historical data. Higher odds of p appearing prior.
Emotion means bet on b but that's cos u don't believe history repeating itself and usually per yr experience most tables are alloted cards favoring banker table cos no comms. And also u remember this chio croupier last time u won also is a banker game majority table.
Discussions are mostly based on opinions. The other side has a lot of glasshearts who are quick to report posts that don't fit their story.
Quote from: Philipkee on Aug 26, 2024, 09:03 PMRecently I had a discussion with a friend. He is very logical and data driven while I am more of the emotional and tiagong side.
So we discussed on this topic. And I realise it's very hard to get him to see my point of view and vice versa. Cos he demands facts and data.
Example
If a govt policy negatively affects 20% but positively affects 80%, is it a good policy?
Based on absolute data, it's a good policy. It sucks to be the 20% but that is "feeling" cos based on data and logic, it benefits the majority and that's it.
Cost of living. If someone kpkb to him about increased cost of living for Singaporeans, he will ask is it only you being affected or many Singaporeans?
if it's only you, it's only one person and the G has to think for the rest
If it's many Singaporeans, he will say name them. Cos anyone can say many Singaporeans to prove a point, right or wrong. Give data or prove that many Singaporeans actually face the problem (actual survey and matched with actual salaries).
And many other examples
But I did mention to him that if going purely by logic, it will be a very cold and selfish world and his comment is that it has always been a cold and selfish world.
What do you people think?
Should discussions be made based on logic or emotions? And of cos by extension should decisions be made based on emotions or logic?
Example. A very ill baby with no real hope of survival. Let's say a 1 year old not breathing for 20 minutes Liao.
Logically, call it quits based on data and prognosis
Emotionally, keep trying cos the baby is so young must do the best even if logically you know no more hope.
What will you choose?
I alws say I feel food easily inc 30-50% price over post Covid 2021 till now
https://mothership.sg/2024/08/bukit-merah-fuzhou-fishball-closed-down-rent/
Giving u all one random example
We alws say we hawker heritage
Must appreciate n save our old flavours
reno here reno there
End up rental jump fr 2k to 6k for super lkk estate
Now I think they sell 4.5-6 ish
If x3 rental , means each bowl easily 5.5-7.5
How can jobless elderly afford unless they rich elder ?
Quote from: EncourageSome1 on Aug 27, 2024, 03:49 PMI alws say I feel food easily inc 30-50% price over post Covid 2021 till now
https://mothership.sg/2024/08/bukit-merah-fuzhou-fishball-closed-down-rent/
Giving u all one random example
We alws say we hawker heritage
Must appreciate n save our old flavours
reno here reno there
End up rental jump fr 2k to 6k for super lkk estate
Now I think they sell 4.5-6 ish
If x3 rental , means each bowl easily 5.5-7.5
How can jobless elderly afford unless they rich elder ?
Going by logic, if the price increase is not in sync with rental increase, it means previously they were earning much more.
Cos in your example, the price increase is 1.5x while rental increase is 3x
I get your point. Just saying that if looking at data purely, it's very easy to get data to read whatever you want
Quote from: Philipkee on Aug 27, 2024, 04:30 PMGoing by logic, if the price increase is not in sync with rental increase, it means previously they were earning much more.
Cos in your example, the price increase is 1.5x while rental increase is 3x
I get your point. Just saying that if looking at data purely, it's very easy to get data to read whatever you want
Can earn 6-10k who wants 3-6k? Ppl all hv same wants for more convenience
Less energy expended
Least cost to ownself
Other ppl we tend to care less or ignore
It's all normal
Until many many many become majority say : we cannot alr
That s why I said democracy only serve e voting majority
Who r voting majority when most ppl I see in our community r no longer who we knew fr young but are everyone from everywhere
Of course we learn fr them their good ways n their multiculturalism
But we also import lot of problems
Cannot say one sidedly say overcrowdedness is gd we want diversity and kick can away
Quote from: Banned User on Aug 27, 2024, 10:24 AMDiscussions are mostly based on opinions. The other side has a lot of glasshearts who are quick to report posts that don't fit their story.
Cesspool there.
Quote from: Philipkee on Aug 26, 2024, 09:03 PMRecently I had a discussion with a friend. He is very logical and data driven while I am more of the emotional and tiagong side.
So we discussed on this topic. And I realise it's very hard to get him to see my point of view and vice versa. Cos he demands facts and data.
Example
If a govt policy negatively affects 20% but positively affects 80%, is it a good policy?
Based on absolute data, it's a good policy. It sucks to be the 20% but that is "feeling" cos based on data and logic, it benefits the majority and that's it.
Cost of living. If someone kpkb to him about increased cost of living for Singaporeans, he will ask is it only you being affected or many Singaporeans?
if it's only you, it's only one person and the G has to think for the rest
If it's many Singaporeans, he will say name them. Cos anyone can say many Singaporeans to prove a point, right or wrong. Give data or prove that many Singaporeans actually face the problem (actual survey and matched with actual salaries).
And many other examples
But I did mention to him that if going purely by logic, it will be a very cold and selfish world and his comment is that it has always been a cold and selfish world.
What do you people think?
Should discussions be made based on logic or emotions? And of cos by extension should decisions be made based on emotions or logic?
Example. A very ill baby with no real hope of survival. Let's say a 1 year old not breathing for 20 minutes Liao.
Logically, call it quits based on data and prognosis
Emotionally, keep trying cos the baby is so young must do the best even if logically you know no more hope.
What will you choose?
Too logical or too emotional/feeling based also not too good ba, wears down others very fast. My take is this, life and death/money related/political matters then better be logic based, the others bring in personal emotions is fine.
You might be the only friend of your that too logical friend, such people very hard to hang out with
Quote from: HuatOngHeng on Aug 28, 2024, 12:45 PMToo logical or too emotional/feeling based also not too good ba, wears down others very fast. My take is this, life and death/money related/political matters then better be logic based, the others bring in personal emotions is fine.
You might be the only friend of your that too logical friend, such people very hard to hang out with
Not really cos I only have ONE such friend. So not too bad.
But yea it's hard to discuss things with him but I still do cos it's good to hear what other people think rather than just echo chambers
Just remember, whether using logic or emotion, you can never win an argument with a woman..😜
CheerS!!!😉
With friends - emo, no logic, drunk also can
With corlicks - facts only. cb mai come give me your emo emo input at work, i not your father. i need work done.